Bitcoin 101 - CoinDesk

Transcript of Developer Meeting in Discord - April 12, 2019

Tron04/12/2019
Hello everyone.
It's been a good couple of weeks for Ravencoin.
Sorry I missed the last session. I was on vacation.
Jeremy is looking at channel settings. Can anyone else chat?
RavencoinDev (Jesse/Wolfsokta)04/12/2019
Hello Everybody!
Under04/12/2019
Hey Tron! Hey Jesse!
RavencoinDev (Jesse/Wolfsokta)04/12/2019
Hey Under. Thanks for joining us.
Tron04/12/2019
Ok, still locked. Working on it.
Who knows how to open the channel?
Under04/12/2019
@traysi ★★★★★
RavencoinDev (Jesse/Wolfsokta)04/12/2019
Maybe we start with just you running the show Tron? You can translate the blond frog speak...
Tron04/12/2019
We can all chat, but it isn't a community chat. It would just be a speech.
[Dev-Happy] Blondfrogs04/12/2019
Seems as though, they thought that the @Core Developer open open the channel, but we can't :frowning:
RavencoinDev (Jesse/Wolfsokta)04/12/2019
Ah, I see.
Tron04/12/2019
Ok, the [pot leaf] means you agree, and the [mushroom] means you disagree. GO!
This is the best.
Much less dissent. :smiley:
Ok, we thought we had the ability to open the channel, but it doesn't seem to be the case. To "thenest"!
traysi ★★★★★04/12/2019
Channel should be open now
bitspill04/12/2019
woot
Hans_Schmidt04/12/2019
Hallo! Now it's unlocked. This is always the problem with tight security - it can backfire.
𝕿𝖍𝖊 𝕯𝖔𝖓 𝕳𝖆𝖗𝖎𝖘𝖙𝖔 CEO ∞04/12/2019
thanks @traysi ★★★★★
Under04/12/2019
Thanks guys
[Master] Roshii04/12/2019
it is
Vincent04/12/2019
:nerd:
traysi ★★★★★04/12/2019
I updated Core Developer permissions to manage this channel. Should work in the future.
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor04/12/2019
Tron Bruce had mentioned wanting Restricted Assets as a wallet control instead of being on chain. Thoughts?
Tron04/12/2019
>> Tron Bruce had mentioned wanting Restricted Assets as a wallet control instead of being on chain. Thoughts?
I'm not 100% sure what that means.
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor04/12/2019
Also, seems to me from just being around here pretty much all day everyday that the community support to have only the original asset holder being the only one ever to issue a restricted asset of the same name is basically 99% universal
Tron04/12/2019
Lots of stuff can be done on the 2nd layer, but not restricting peer to peer trades for those holding their own keys. That's the main reason for Tags and Restricted Assets.
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor04/12/2019
Basically Bruce wants to keep restricted asset issuance capabilities at the wallet level
I'm seeing a big security issue with going that route
Chill04/12/2019
I don't want to put words into Bruce's mouth, but that is my understanding as well
Tron04/12/2019
Explain "wallet level" Wallet is a container for private keys in my vernacular.
𝕿𝖍𝖊 𝕯𝖔𝖓 𝕳𝖆𝖗𝖎𝖘𝖙𝖔 CEO ∞04/12/2019
brb, googling vernacular
Tron04/12/2019
:smiley:
𝕿𝖍𝖊 𝕯𝖔𝖓 𝕳𝖆𝖗𝖎𝖘𝖙𝖔 CEO ∞04/12/2019
learn something new every day
Chill04/12/2019
from verna, meaning house slave. That's you, CEO!
Tron04/12/2019
Sorry, in bitcoin terminology.
bhorn04/12/2019
https://twitter.com/brucefenton/status/1116482635314999296
Bruce Fenton (@brucefenton)
Wallet level controls for securities might offer the best of both worlds: decentralized protocols with the ability for issuers to program and control their digital assets based on whatever rules they choose.
Twitter
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor04/12/2019
@Tron Sorry, I wouldn't fully know exactly what Bruce was thinking when he mentioned this to the community, might not be a bad idea to get in touch with him at some point
That ^^^
Sevvy (not worried til 500sats)04/12/2019
it will need to be somehow baked into the chain, though. No?
otherwise wallet code circumventing it could be conceived
S1LVA | GetRavencoin.org04/12/2019
If any of the committing devs have topics or updates they'd like to bring up, shooot
Tron04/12/2019
Ah, ok. I think that means that issuers can control issuance with their keys and determine whether the recipient is Reg D, Reg S, Accredited, etc. That wouldn't be an on-chain function, and might need to be done first. Only later when secondary trading is approved/allowed/enabled/etc then the Restricted Asset idea is important for those that want to hold their keys/assets.
IRSJonPizza | JON.NETWORK04/12/2019
When better privacy... And how?
Tron04/12/2019
None of this matters if it is held by a regulated custodian.
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor04/12/2019
@Tron Yeah, seems to me from a security standpoint, that would be a bad idea
Tron04/12/2019
No PII (Personally Identifiable Information) should go on-chain.
Sevvy (not worried til 500sats)04/12/2019
so even wallet side things that Bruce mentions rely on the chain having tagged and restricted assets
correct?
Tron04/12/2019
But, in the US, the laws are such for Securities that KYC has to be done for issuance for sure, and likely for trading in a centralized exchange or ATS.
The idea behind tags and assets is to restrict assets to addresses that are tagged. The chain is completely unaware of any other rules. It is just a tool set.
Sevvy (not worried til 500sats)04/12/2019
understood
Synicide04/12/2019
@Tron has there been any further thought/discussions about the hot topic from the previous dev meeting of uniqueness between regular assets and restricted assets? Last meeting ideas were tossed around for a grace peroid, or sharing unique names.
Under04/12/2019
KYC Isn’t a requirement for lottery. Do you think blending in that use case hurts or helps Ravencoin legitimacy? Could the activity of unregulated securities trading, slowly become the norm much as in the same way pot is becoming legalized? How do we by code accommodate existing systems without giving up on the goal of changing the way fundamentallly people participate in the equity market?
Tron04/12/2019
We've talked about it, but no decisions yet.
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor04/12/2019
Lastly, was thinking the dev meeting time is probably not the ideal place for community randoms like myself to voice our thoughts about non-technical specifics like we're discussing currently. Before the hard fork would it be a good idea to kinda have an open mic online forum where the devs and community can get together and talk about some of the governance type issues?
Hans_Schmidt04/12/2019
Is the current plan still to include both messaging and restricted assets in the next release/fork? GUI included or only consensus/rpc level?
Tron04/12/2019
In general, we feel that XYZ is different than $XYZ. There is some additional on-chain burden like holding the rule-set for the restricted asset.
S1LVA | GetRavencoin.org04/12/2019
Could making the !Ownership token reissueable as $Ownership, Be viable? Keeping asset names unique for their owners?
Tron04/12/2019
Tags have to be held by wallets, so there should be a cost to tagging.
[Dev-Happy] Blondfrogs04/12/2019
@Hans_Schmidt We are going to try and release them on mainnet at the same time.
S1LVA | GetRavencoin.org04/12/2019
Asset names being unique on chain, no matter the type, would be ideal.
[Dev-Happy] Blondfrogs04/12/2019
Not sure about the GUI though.
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor04/12/2019
@S1LVA | GetRavencoin.org Yes I feel therr may be a disconnect on this issue between the community and the dev team regarding what u say
Chill04/12/2019
I have yet to interact with anyone here who is in favor of overlapping names, to be honest
Sevvy (not worried til 500sats)04/12/2019
yep
IRSJonPizza | JON.NETWORK04/12/2019
No overlaps
S1LVA | GetRavencoin.org04/12/2019
"Token names are guaranteed unique."
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor04/12/2019
Which is why I've kinda suggested maybe a round table on this issue before we try to push the code through
Tron04/12/2019
Do you think that sentiment would hold with the wider community?
Sevvy (not worried til 500sats)04/12/2019
It does in my experience
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor04/12/2019
I've seen nobody who prefers the grace period idea
S1LVA | GetRavencoin.org04/12/2019
We need to properly survey all channels
IRSJonPizza | JON.NETWORK04/12/2019
We can do a discord vote
Sevvy (not worried til 500sats)04/12/2019
needs to be wider than discord
S1LVA | GetRavencoin.org04/12/2019
Discord is not enough, discord is not the community.
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor04/12/2019
For sure
Sevvy (not worried til 500sats)04/12/2019
Yeah not by a long shot
Synicide04/12/2019
I would at least like to hear an argument on why they shouldnt be. There have been several arguments on why they should be.
Sevvy (not worried til 500sats)04/12/2019
twitter, telegram, etc
pool operators
Hans_Schmidt04/12/2019
It could cost a fee to make an asset restricted, and still only the original owner could do it. Issue first, then restrict.
Chill04/12/2019
That's what I was going to say. I have yet to hear an argument that explains why the names should be overlapped
Tron04/12/2019
@S1LVA | GetRavencoin.org I agree. If there's a way to survey the wider community, I think we should go with it.
IRSJonPizza | JON.NETWORK04/12/2019
Well, i guess you can try to push it, let the miners decide
Sevvy (not worried til 500sats)04/12/2019
The owner of !ASSET ought to have enduring, sole right to create $ASSET
S1LVA | GetRavencoin.org04/12/2019
If anyone has the position that they can be made non unique by a seprate $ownership issuance, Please pm me and we can have a discussion on my youtube stream.
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor04/12/2019
@Tron once the voting layer has been activated, this will all be so much easier :yum:
Sevvy (not worried til 500sats)04/12/2019
assuming an official vote token is produced
But that would be kind of centralized
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor04/12/2019
Nothing is official of course
Vincent04/12/2019
the needs to be a logical explanation on how it will be better for the coin to have them not connected
Hardman (CEO - dipshit)04/12/2019
I normally never speak in development-meetings. But I agree with @S1LVA | GetRavencoin.org's opinion. >>Asset names being unique on chain, no matter the type, would be ideal.<<
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor04/12/2019
But it's better than having nothing for the devs to rely upon when deciding how the code is gonna be pushed out
Hardman (CEO - dipshit)04/12/2019
And no I don't own any asset :)
IRSJonPizza | JON.NETWORK04/12/2019
Assets being not unique = Fraud and confusion
Hardman (CEO - dipshit)04/12/2019
It would in fact be in my personal benefit if it isn't going to be that way, to squat important names.
Synicide04/12/2019
There have been many potential issues/confusion brought up with them not being unique. But no one understands the counter argument
Tron04/12/2019
I don't have a dog in the hunt. If it is better for the project for $BCD and BCD to be treated as the same -- even though they're different textually and different types of tokens, then I'm ok with that. What I don't want, is to make a decision that has lasting repercussions for the project based on the voices of a few that may have a vested interest because they secured good names.
[Dev-Happy] Blondfrogs04/12/2019
Don't worry, Tron is typing :smiley:
Vincent04/12/2019
**jeopardy theme song*
Tron04/12/2019
That's why I mention the "wider" community.
S1LVA | GetRavencoin.org04/12/2019
Absolutely the route to take, gathering the opinions of the greater community.
Vincent04/12/2019
can u give one good counter argument ?
kott04/12/2019
so no counter argument ?!
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor04/12/2019
Agreed and this should only be the start of this conversation
bhorn04/12/2019
>>from Tron: they're different textually and different types of tokens
sounds like a counter
Vincent04/12/2019
the only one i can think of is a new life on name squating which in no way helps the project
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor04/12/2019
I only bring this up because it seems 99% here prefer forever instead of a grace period. Makes me think it's worthy of discussing to the wider community
Tron04/12/2019
For sure grace period.
S1LVA | GetRavencoin.org04/12/2019
There no argument that it merits discussion
Chill04/12/2019
any company will be forced to buy the !asset and $asset anyway
Vincent04/12/2019
seems like a brexit vote.... revote until the correct vote is recieved
Hardman (CEO - dipshit)04/12/2019
@Tron I agree, if this is going to have lasting repercussions for the project, and will only benefit a few, they should be separated. But then we should asses what the implications would be of doing it or not doing it. Are those known?
bhorn04/12/2019
as a non-developer, it would be confusing to me if ASSETNAME and $ASSETNAME were not related
Tron04/12/2019
If the wider community is for the non-restricted asset having precedent forever to get the token, then its easy to do.
bhorn04/12/2019
hearing about name uniquness, but then those two not being unique, seems like a contradiction
Hardman (CEO - dipshit)04/12/2019
I am all for what is best for the blockchain implementations that will come in the future.
Tron04/12/2019
@bhorn But we can't enforce that. Only at first. $ASSETNAME could be sent to someone else.
Hardman (CEO - dipshit)04/12/2019
They are unique because they are different asset types.
IRSJonPizza | JON.NETWORK04/12/2019
Literally you garentee unique names, then you say nvm... It's like saying this crypto u made is capped at 2000 coins then you say nvm its 1000000
Hardman (CEO - dipshit)04/12/2019
From a code perspective its still unique.
bhorn04/12/2019
but the unique names is for the user
being able to trust the name
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor04/12/2019
I'd also add, one of the selling points of RVN over ERC-20 is the ability to only have one unique name ever
bhorn04/12/2019
if you open up the $ASSETNAME to the non-original owner, now someone new can squat it
Vincent04/12/2019
so there really hasn't been a good point yet
bhorn04/12/2019
and it is no longer uniquely owned by the original issuer
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor04/12/2019
Statt getting into same name separate asset things and that starts to get confusing
Sevvy (not worried til 500sats)04/12/2019
they are de facto unique
Hardman (CEO - dipshit)04/12/2019
I think it would be good to have an overview of the benefits and downsides of both ways of implementation.
Sevvy (not worried til 500sats)04/12/2019
@IRSJonPizza | JON.NETWORK I think you miscomprehend
Vincent04/12/2019
thats not a good argument
Hardman (CEO - dipshit)04/12/2019
Rn we're all kawwing into nothing.
S1LVA | GetRavencoin.org04/12/2019
Giving the !Ownership token the power to reissue as $Ownership would make our Ownership tokens more valuable, overall.
Tron04/12/2019
What if the system required purchase of the non-restricted asset first. If you want $GOOGLE, buy GOOGLE first.
Chill04/12/2019
superb
IRSJonPizza | JON.NETWORK04/12/2019
Yep
Sevvy (not worried til 500sats)04/12/2019
ohhhhh
NIce Tron
S1LVA | GetRavencoin.org04/12/2019
Yes, you must own !Ownership
Vincent04/12/2019
agree and will go back to building apple in ur garage yrs before needing restrictes asset
Sevvy (not worried til 500sats)04/12/2019
that's what i've been saying
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor04/12/2019
Yessir
Sevvy (not worried til 500sats)04/12/2019
The owner of !ASSET ought to have enduring, sole right to create $ASSET
whosoever owns it
may then create the $ASSET
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor04/12/2019
U got the ownership token, u got the name
IRSJonPizza | JON.NETWORK04/12/2019
As soon as tron says it everyone agrees... Lol
Vincent04/12/2019
yes, we all agree to that i believe
Sevvy (not worried til 500sats)04/12/2019
That's what a lot of us were saying I think
Hardman (CEO - dipshit)04/12/2019
I really would dislike it if it would have negative implications for rvn and that few moneyminds will benefit from it.
[Dev-Happy] Blondfrogs04/12/2019
i think that could work. So GOOGLE! issues -> $GOOGLE?
Chill04/12/2019
perfect
Sevvy (not worried til 500sats)04/12/2019
I think some of us were phrasing it differently or conceiving of it differently because some of us are thinking from a user perspective and some are thinking from a developer perspective
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor04/12/2019
@[Dev-Happy] Blondfrogs Exactly
S1LVA | GetRavencoin.org04/12/2019
@[Dev-Happy] Blondfrogs More specifically, !Google issues > $Google
Sevvy (not worried til 500sats)04/12/2019
yeah exactly
Chill04/12/2019
Then, if there is some sort of new token that is needed in the future, GOOGLE has already secured the rights to create that one as well
Tron04/12/2019
The exclamation mark is at the end.
Hans_Schmidt04/12/2019
That's exactly what I proposed earlier. Create or buy owner first. Then restrict for another fee.
Sevvy (not worried til 500sats)04/12/2019
I always mess that up. putting the ! at the beginning
Hardman (CEO - dipshit)04/12/2019
I know for a matter of fact multiple people own many assets in here. I want to remain neutral here. But you guys speak for your own interest, not for the project.
IRSJonPizza | JON.NETWORK04/12/2019
How much should restricted fee be?
Tron04/12/2019
Oh no, the price discussion. :wink:
Sevvy (not worried til 500sats)04/12/2019
gotta go!
run tron!
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor04/12/2019
@Hardman (CEO - dipshit) a community coin takes into consideration everyone's interest
theking04/12/2019
@Tron that makes a lot of sense. Buy the non restricted first and only when you own that can you purchase or create a restricted.
Vincent04/12/2019
i disagree @Hardman (CEO - dipshit) there hasnt been a good counter argument
Synicide04/12/2019
sounds like a great solution, and fixes the !UNIQUE + $UNIQUE <> UNIQUE issue many have
Tron04/12/2019
I'm becoming convinced on the asset name thing.
[Dev-Happy] Blondfrogs04/12/2019
How much do you think is should cost to make a restricted asset guys/girls?
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor04/12/2019
I was thinking 750-1000
S1LVA | GetRavencoin.org04/12/2019
500RVN
Gintonic (sold Honda)04/12/2019
Same as unique - 500
RavenLord 🐦04/12/2019
500
Vincent04/12/2019
i dont like the fixed cost discussion (old fight)
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor04/12/2019
Or maybe if u already own the !asset, just add another 250-500 to get it created
Synicide04/12/2019
It needs to cost enough to where only people that need that functionality buy it IMO
Chill04/12/2019
Since we do not know whether any future types of tokens will be needed (as the future is not set yet), giving one name control over that name in all current assets and future types of assets is a logical solution. It's a future-proof solution
Hans_Schmidt04/12/2019
same as create new main asset
RigbyMiner04/12/2019
restricted asset should cost 3-5 times that of a regular asset.
Hardman (CEO - dipshit)04/12/2019
Then, if it costs money, why would YOU only be able to register it?
Sevvy (not worried til 500sats)04/12/2019
100 for sub. 500 for main. 2500 for restricted?
5x 5x?
Tron04/12/2019
(750+250+500+5000+500) / 5
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor04/12/2019
IMO restricted assets add extra user tools to the OG assets so they should cost more than 500 to create
Chill04/12/2019
The cost for the restricted token should be only commensurate with the cost to the network imo
Vincent04/12/2019
when the coin is accepted by the masses, there will be plenty of burning
no need for inflated (imo)
nobody is gonna issue restricted, just because
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor04/12/2019
Plus I think the difference in cost should also promote usage of the OG asset when a user doesn't need the added functionality of a restricted asset
Sevvy (not worried til 500sats)04/12/2019
if you think about it a restricted already costs more than a main, because it includes having already paid for the main
Hans_Schmidt04/12/2019
Before we run out of time- What is the current eta for restricted/messaging mainnet release - How much time to security debug? Are there plans for another bug bounty program?
Jeroz04/12/2019
What if I want only my guild members or game buyers to trade my coins or items or dragon kill points. Why should I pay more for an asset then?
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor04/12/2019
I'd like to thank everyone for attending the #governance-meeting today :joy::joy::joy:
Gintonic (sold Honda)04/12/2019
Unpopular thought: Could we let the devs to discuss about other issues?
Tron04/12/2019
We are going to have another wallet for Android that does BIP44 and handles assets. There will be a classic RVN only wallet, and an asset-aware wallet that is seed-compatible with iOS wallet.
Coming soon. Testing it in the next few hours.
traysi ★★★★★04/12/2019
The last wallet was not released as open source. Will the next one be?
Vincent04/12/2019
wen wallet for my windows phone???
Jeroz04/12/2019
Quick before the end and while I’m walking to pick up my son:
I'm not sure if I can make the meeting but wanted to show a list of things that are going on outside of the core development and things that I think deserve attention:
- Ravenland made an OS for the PI, which significantly reduces the difficulty threshold of creating full nodes. https://ravencoinos.org/. I am still planning on helping @push | ravenland.org with some tools for it but very swamped with work lately (Sorry @push | ravenland.org!)
- Mangofarm is very busy developing their web-wallet and asset management services. https://www.mangofarmassets.com/. There will be new features coming.
- Mangofarm is in a far stage with Trezor integration and just finished their first transaction.
- Mangofarm and Ravenland are busy setting up an IPFS swarm to make sure all RVN data will stay active. Reach out to them if you like to be a part of it.
- I am in continuous talks with people/services interested in supporting RVN (I get mainly approached on telegram). And would like to mention once again that, imho, Raven could greatly benefit from a bounty system like: https://bounty.bitcoin.com/. Not only to 1 attract devs but also because 2 people don't know how to donate (yes I am getting the question), 3 current community funds are poorly managed, if at all, 4 there are coin services emerging where trading fees can be routed back to community projects and without going into details, I do talk to some.
Tron04/12/2019
It is open source. Both will be.
traysi ★★★★★04/12/2019
Current Android wallet is not on github.
Tron04/12/2019
Super cool stuff from Ravenland and MangoFarm !!!!
[Master] Roshii04/12/2019
https://github.com/RavenProject/ravenwallet-android
GitHub
RavenProject/ravenwallet-android
Contribute to RavenProject/ravenwallet-android development by creating an account on GitHub.
traysi ★★★★★04/12/2019
Latest commit 5134271 on Oct 4, 2018
Tron04/12/2019
Could we use the same people that did the legal fund to do a bounty fund?
traysi ★★★★★04/12/2019
Is that the latest version @[Master] Roshii ?
S1LVA | GetRavencoin.org04/12/2019
Bounty for what @Tron
[Master] Roshii04/12/2019
Yes
Tron04/12/2019
For the wallet for download.
That will become RVN Wallet Classic.
traysi ★★★★★04/12/2019
It seems some people are using an android wallet different than that one.
DirkDiggler (RVN ded)04/12/2019
back to the discussion on the Restricted asset cost - it seems to me that it should be 5k +, as it's such a specialized use case (institutions)... KYC/AML shouldn't be cheap
CPT d0JA04/12/2019
im all for bounties for things but they must be discussed upon and agreed in public space and i dont think its fair if certain people have access to that knowledge of bounties before they are posted to get a head start on the work and claim the bounty right after its posted
my 2 pennies
Tron04/12/2019
The PR in there is for asset support. We're testing this afternoon
Vincent04/12/2019
@DirkDiggler (RVN ded) i think cheap, the more users the merrier
IRSJonPizza | JON.NETWORK04/12/2019
Def needs to be real expensive... I dont wanna see a market for this
Hardman (CEO - dipshit)04/12/2019
@CPT d0JA I agree with you. All should be done and agreed upon in public. Nothing in backrooms.
Tron04/12/2019
So I have a "cheap" and a "real expensive". PERFECT!
DirkDiggler (RVN ded)04/12/2019
consensus :)
kott04/12/2019
must be expensive
Vincent04/12/2019
we want RVN used...make it affordable for all
bhorn04/12/2019
i'm with wider-use
less expensive
Tron04/12/2019
Two cheaps and two real expensive.
Vincent04/12/2019
to be continued......
DirkDiggler (RVN ded)04/12/2019
these guys arent seeing the big picture of who would be using this type of asset
cheap is a relative term
CPT d0JA04/12/2019
so moving forward if people have some good ideas for bounties they should be posted in a public space and then discussed amongst the community, there should be no closed room discussions or people in power making the decisions on which bounties are posted, especially for things the coin doesnt need.
Synicide04/12/2019
tags can be used for many use cases outside of KYC though, as Tron has used subscriptions as an example
DirkDiggler (RVN ded)04/12/2019
as is expensive...
Vincent04/12/2019
@Tronare u aware of any tokens, like vinsent, that will issue and burn a lot of coin just based on the use plan?
Sevvy (not worried til 500sats)04/12/2019
unique assets, despite being only 5RVN could burn a lot of RVN
theDopeMedic04/12/2019
What would that do to the burn if it's more expensive?
Hardman (CEO - dipshit)04/12/2019
I think the choice should be made in a way that its good for the basis of the project, not for interest of a few, sounds harsh I know. What if new asset_types arise, will those owning the current asset always get a freecard to get it first? Wouldn't be fair.
Vincent04/12/2019
agree
DirkDiggler (RVN ded)04/12/2019
5000 ravens burned to KYC folks is a bargain... and it helps all us dipshit bag holders of RVN
Vincent04/12/2019
if GM tokenized each vehicle...they would burn a lot annually
bhorn04/12/2019
imagine years down the road, if price continues to increase
Tron04/12/2019
I agree that the types of organizations that would use for SEC compliance are not going to worry whether it costs $5 or $100. But some subscription, games, vip groups, etc. may be more price sensitive.
Vincent04/12/2019
why are u worrying about the cost of running other peoples business tho...it is about RVN acceptance
CPT d0JA04/12/2019
increasing the burn rate has the negative affect of reducing the total number of assets that can be created on ravencoin
bhorn04/12/2019
it could get to the point where its prohibitively expensive to use the chain
Synicide04/12/2019
we don't want to price out that small guy wanting to run a subscription based platform though, we want as widespread usage as possible
IRSJonPizza | JON.NETWORK04/12/2019
What jf we did something like this :
The more charachers, the cheaper it gets
Let the big corps pay alot on their 3 letters
Vincent04/12/2019
overload
IRSJonPizza | JON.NETWORK04/12/2019
Then small corps can pay less with their 5+ letter assers
Tron04/12/2019
We do want usage (now). But we want the costs to reflect the real cost of chain usage so we don't mess up scaling.
theDopeMedic04/12/2019
Assuming everyone who already owns an asset (19059) issues a restricted at 5k, then that burns 95,285,000 RVN. Not just that, it may be prohibitive to the small guy.
liqdmetal04/12/2019
500 for original and 1500 for restricted (tohelp cover extra on chain burden) is my vote
DirkDiggler (RVN ded)04/12/2019
cost of the restricted asset isn't a hill i am ready to die on... i just think it should be more costly than a standard asset
Vincent04/12/2019
plus think of develping nations...their 'restricted' needs may be much different and expensive will have them lok for alternatives
Tron04/12/2019
@liqdmetal I like that range.
DirkDiggler (RVN ded)04/12/2019
1500 would be good in my book as well
Synicide04/12/2019
I hadn't picked a number in mind, but I like that range too
liqdmetal04/12/2019
so total cost for a restricted would be 500 + 1500
DirkDiggler (RVN ded)04/12/2019
2k all in? i like
Vincent04/12/2019
500/500
IRSJonPizza | JON.NETWORK04/12/2019
Sounds good to me
Tron04/12/2019
Everybody was all at 500/1500 until Vincent. WTH
Vincent04/12/2019
haha
Tron04/12/2019
Just kidding.
kott04/12/2019
ignore him 500/1500 is perfect
Vincent04/12/2019
i voted cheap first
DirkDiggler (RVN ded)04/12/2019
there is always one in the crowd :)
theDopeMedic04/12/2019
Is there are favorite horse with the @Core Developer s?
Sevvy (not worried til 500sats)04/12/2019
roger that
𝕿𝖍𝖊 𝕯𝖔𝖓 𝕳𝖆𝖗𝖎𝖘𝖙𝖔 CEO ∞04/12/2019
wait, i didn't approve anything yet :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:
S1LVA | GetRavencoin.org04/12/2019
I see 1500 being reasonable and scalable.
Sevvy (not worried til 500sats)04/12/2019
2k all in for the ! and the $
A reasonable compromise
Synicide04/12/2019
neither of them is bad when we keep in mind Restricted cost is the sum of both
S1LVA | GetRavencoin.org04/12/2019
@theDopeMedic seabiscuit
Sevvy (not worried til 500sats)04/12/2019
manowar
[Master] Roshii04/12/2019
Yes there is are favorite horse with the Core Devs
theDopeMedic04/12/2019
Tonto
bhorn04/12/2019
i'm more agreeable to the higher price given that you need UNIQUE! to get $UNIQUE as well.
Vincent04/12/2019
so we agree. table this decision :nerd:
[Dev-Happy] Blondfrogs04/12/2019
I think we did some good discussion today. Lets call it.
Tron04/12/2019
This was actually really productive. I like where we landed.
Cheers, everyone.
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor04/12/2019
I'd be ok w 500/1500
[Dev-Happy] Blondfrogs04/12/2019
Can we close the channel
@Moderator
S1LVA | GetRavencoin.org04/12/2019
Thanks everyone.
Gintonic (sold Honda)04/12/2019
Thanks
Vincent04/12/2019
:thumbsup:
DirkDiggler (RVN ded)04/12/2019
have a good weekend
IRSJonPizza | JON.NETWORK04/12/2019
Byr
theDopeMedic04/12/2019
Thanks everyone! :beers:
S1LVA | GetRavencoin.org04/12/2019
Happy feet
Seal Clubber04/12/2019
Oh no
IRSJonPizza | JON.NETWORK04/12/2019
:bepbep:... I had to srry
neil04/12/2019
Close!
theDopeMedic04/12/2019
https://tenor.com/view/thanos-confused-gif-11877270
Sevvy (not worried til 500sats)04/12/2019
Thanks Tron
Thanks Devs!
Chill04/12/2019
I'm ok with 500/500 up to 500/1500
Seal Clubber04/12/2019
That would be 2k total right
IRSJonPizza | JON.NETWORK04/12/2019
Quik mas
Vincent04/12/2019
i dont plan on having any restricted assets but just think worldwide it will help the coin to keep it real user friendly
traysi ★★★★★04/12/2019
@[Dev-Happy] Blondfrogs Try closing the channel
Looks like that works.
[Dev-Happy] Blondfrogs04/12/2019
Yep it did :smiley:
i got permissions now :smiley:
submitted by mrderrik to Ravencoin [link] [comments]

BIP39 Words list

Nothing special, just a copy of the current list (for the future) of what can be found at https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/blob/mastebip-0039/english.txt
abandon,ability,able,about,above,absent,absorb,abstract,absurd,abuse,access,accident,account,accuse,achieve,acid,acoustic,acquire,across,act,action,actor,actress,actual,adapt,add,addict,address,adjust,admit,adult,advance,advice,aerobic,affair,afford,afraid,again,age,agent,agree,ahead,aim,air,airport,aisle,alarm,album,alcohol,alert,alien,all,alley,allow,almost,alone,alpha,already,also,alter,always,amateur,amazing,among,amount,amused,analyst,anchor,ancient,anger,angle,angry,animal,ankle,announce,annual,another,answer,antenna,antique,anxiety,any,apart,apology,appear,apple,approve,april,arch,arctic,area,arena,argue,arm,armed,armor,army,around,arrange,arrest,arrive,arrow,art,artefact,artist,artwork,ask,aspect,assault,asset,assist,assume,asthma,athlete,atom,attack,attend,attitude,attract,auction,audit,august,aunt,author,auto,autumn,average,avocado,avoid,awake,aware,away,awesome,awful,awkward,axis,baby,bachelor,bacon,badge,bag,balance,balcony,ball,bamboo,banana,banner,bar,barely,bargain,barrel,base,basic,basket,battle,beach,bean,beauty,because,become,beef,before,begin,behave,behind,believe,below,belt,bench,benefit,best,betray,better,between,beyond,bicycle,bid,bike,bind,biology,bird,birth,bitter,black,blade,blame,blanket,blast,bleak,bless,blind,blood,blossom,blouse,blue,blur,blush,board,boat,body,boil,bomb,bone,bonus,book,boost,border,boring,borrow,boss,bottom,bounce,box,boy,bracket,brain,brand,brass,brave,bread,breeze,brick,bridge,brief,bright,bring,brisk,broccoli,broken,bronze,broom,brother,brown,brush,bubble,buddy,budget,buffalo,build,bulb,bulk,bullet,bundle,bunker,burden,burger,burst,bus,business,busy,butter,buyer,buzz,cabbage,cabin,cable,cactus,cage,cake,call,calm,camera,camp,can,canal,cancel,candy,cannon,canoe,canvas,canyon,capable,capital,captain,car,carbon,card,cargo,carpet,carry,cart,case,cash,casino,castle,casual,cat,catalog,catch,category,cattle,caught,cause,caution,cave,ceiling,celery,cement,census,century,cereal,certain,chair,chalk,champion,change,chaos,chapter,charge,chase,chat,cheap,check,cheese,chef,cherry,chest,chicken,chief,child,chimney,choice,choose,chronic,chuckle,chunk,churn,cigar,cinnamon,circle,citizen,city,civil,claim,clap,clarify,claw,clay,clean,clerk,clever,click,client,cliff,climb,clinic,clip,clock,clog,close,cloth,cloud,clown,club,clump,cluster,clutch,coach,coast,coconut,code,coffee,coil,coin,collect,color,column,combine,come,comfort,comic,common,company,concert,conduct,confirm,congress,connect,consider,control,convince,cook,cool,copper,copy,coral,core,corn,correct,cost,cotton,couch,country,couple,course,cousin,cover,coyote,crack,cradle,craft,cram,crane,crash,crater,crawl,crazy,cream,credit,creek,crew,cricket,crime,crisp,critic,crop,cross,crouch,crowd,crucial,cruel,cruise,crumble,crunch,crush,cry,crystal,cube,culture,cup,cupboard,curious,current,curtain,curve,cushion,custom,cute,cycle,dad,damage,damp,dance,danger,daring,dash,daughter,dawn,day,deal,debate,debris,decade,december,decide,decline,decorate,decrease,deer,defense,define,defy,degree,delay,deliver,demand,demise,denial,dentist,deny,depart,depend,deposit,depth,deputy,derive,describe,desert,design,desk,despair,destroy,detail,detect,develop,device,devote,diagram,dial,diamond,diary,dice,diesel,diet,differ,digital,dignity,dilemma,dinner,dinosaur,direct,dirt,disagree,discover,disease,dish,dismiss,disorder,display,distance,divert,divide,divorce,dizzy,doctor,document,dog,doll,dolphin,domain,donate,donkey,donor,door,dose,double,dove,draft,dragon,drama,drastic,draw,dream,dress,drift,drill,drink,drip,drive,drop,drum,dry,duck,dumb,dune,during,dust,dutch,duty,dwarf,dynamic,eager,eagle,early,earn,earth,easily,east,easy,echo,ecology,economy,edge,edit,educate,effort,egg,eight,either,elbow,elder,electric,elegant,element,elephant,elevator,elite,else,embark,embody,embrace,emerge,emotion,employ,empower,empty,enable,enact,end,endless,endorse,enemy,energy,enforce,engage,engine,enhance,enjoy,enlist,enough,enrich,enroll,ensure,enter,entire,entry,envelope,episode,equal,equip,era,erase,erode,erosion,error,erupt,escape,essay,essence,estate,eternal,ethics,evidence,evil,evoke,evolve,exact,example,excess,exchange,excite,exclude,excuse,execute,exercise,exhaust,exhibit,exile,exist,exit,exotic,expand,expect,expire,explain,expose,express,extend,extra,eye,eyebrow,fabric,face,faculty,fade,faint,faith,fall,false,fame,family,famous,fan,fancy,fantasy,farm,fashion,fat,fatal,father,fatigue,fault,favorite,feature,february,federal,fee,feed,feel,female,fence,festival,fetch,fever,few,fiber,fiction,field,figure,file,film,filter,final,find,fine,finger,finish,fire,firm,first,fiscal,fish,fit,fitness,fix,flag,flame,flash,flat,flavor,flee,flight,flip,float,flock,floor,flower,fluid,flush,fly,foam,focus,fog,foil,fold,follow,food,foot,force,forest,forget,fork,fortune,forum,forward,fossil,foster,found,fox,fragile,frame,frequent,fresh,friend,fringe,frog,front,frost,frown,frozen,fruit,fuel,fun,funny,furnace,fury,future,gadget,gain,galaxy,gallery,game,gap,garage,garbage,garden,garlic,garment,gas,gasp,gate,gather,gauge,gaze,general,genius,genre,gentle,genuine,gesture,ghost,giant,gift,giggle,ginger,giraffe,girl,give,glad,glance,glare,glass,glide,glimpse,globe,gloom,glory,glove,glow,glue,goat,goddess,gold,good,goose,gorilla,gospel,gossip,govern,gown,grab,grace,grain,grant,grape,grass,gravity,great,green,grid,grief,grit,grocery,group,grow,grunt,guard,guess,guide,guilt,guitar,gun,gym,habit,hair,half,hammer,hamster,hand,happy,harbor,hard,harsh,harvest,hat,have,hawk,hazard,head,health,heart,heavy,hedgehog,height,hello,helmet,help,hen,hero,hidden,high,hill,hint,hip,hire,history,hobby,hockey,hold,hole,holiday,hollow,home,honey,hood,hope,horn,horror,horse,hospital,host,hotel,hour,hover,hub,huge,human,humble,humor,hundred,hungry,hunt,hurdle,hurry,hurt,husband,hybrid,ice,icon,idea,identify,idle,ignore,ill,illegal,illness,image,imitate,immense,immune,impact,impose,improve,impulse,inch,include,income,increase,index,indicate,indoor,industry,infant,inflict,inform,inhale,inherit,initial,inject,injury,inmate,inner,innocent,input,inquiry,insane,insect,inside,inspire,install,intact,interest,into,invest,invite,involve,iron,island,isolate,issue,item,ivory,jacket,jaguar,jar,jazz,jealous,jeans,jelly,jewel,job,join,joke,journey,joy,judge,juice,jump,jungle,junior,junk,just,kangaroo,keen,keep,ketchup,key,kick,kid,kidney,kind,kingdom,kiss,kit,kitchen,kite,kitten,kiwi,knee,knife,knock,know,lab,label,labor,ladder,lady,lake,lamp,language,laptop,large,later,latin,laugh,laundry,lava,law,lawn,lawsuit,layer,lazy,leader,leaf,learn,leave,lecture,left,leg,legal,legend,leisure,lemon,lend,length,lens,leopard,lesson,letter,level,liar,liberty,library,license,life,lift,light,like,limb,limit,link,lion,liquid,list,little,live,lizard,load,loan,lobster,local,lock,logic,lonely,long,loop,lottery,loud,lounge,love,loyal,lucky,luggage,lumber,lunar,lunch,luxury,lyrics,machine,mad,magic,magnet,maid,mail,main,major,make,mammal,man,manage,mandate,mango,mansion,manual,maple,marble,march,margin,marine,market,marriage,mask,mass,master,match,material,math,matrix,matter,maximum,maze,meadow,mean,measure,meat,mechanic,medal,media,melody,melt,member,memory,mention,menu,mercy,merge,merit,merry,mesh,message,metal,method,middle,midnight,milk,million,mimic,mind,minimum,minor,minute,miracle,mirror,misery,miss,mistake,mix,mixed,mixture,mobile,model,modify,mom,moment,monitor,monkey,monster,month,moon,moral,more,morning,mosquito,mother,motion,motor,mountain,mouse,move,movie,much,muffin,mule,multiply,muscle,museum,mushroom,music,must,mutual,myself,mystery,myth,naive,name,napkin,narrow,nasty,nation,nature,near,neck,need,negative,neglect,neither,nephew,nerve,nest,net,network,neutral,never,news,next,nice,night,noble,noise,nominee,noodle,normal,north,nose,notable,note,nothing,notice,novel,now,nuclear,number,nurse,nut,oak,obey,object,oblige,obscure,observe,obtain,obvious,occur,ocean,october,odor,off,offer,office,often,oil,okay,old,olive,olympic,omit,once,one,onion,online,only,open,opera,opinion,oppose,option,orange,orbit,orchard,order,ordinary,organ,orient,original,orphan,ostrich,other,outdoor,outer,output,outside,oval,oven,over,own,owner,oxygen,oyster,ozone,pact,paddle,page,pair,palace,palm,panda,panel,panic,panther,paper,parade,parent,park,parrot,party,pass,patch,path,patient,patrol,pattern,pause,pave,payment,peace,peanut,pear,peasant,pelican,pen,penalty,pencil,people,pepper,perfect,permit,person,pet,phone,photo,phrase,physical,piano,picnic,picture,piece,pig,pigeon,pill,pilot,pink,pioneer,pipe,pistol,pitch,pizza,place,planet,plastic,plate,play,please,pledge,pluck,plug,plunge,poem,poet,point,polar,pole,police,pond,pony,pool,popular,portion,position,possible,post,potato,pottery,poverty,powder,power,practice,praise,predict,prefer,prepare,present,pretty,prevent,price,pride,primary,print,priority,prison,private,prize,problem,process,produce,profit,program,project,promote,proof,property,prosper,protect,proud,provide,public,pudding,pull,pulp,pulse,pumpkin,punch,pupil,puppy,purchase,purity,purpose,purse,push,put,puzzle,pyramid,quality,quantum,quarter,question,quick,quit,quiz,quote,rabbit,raccoon,race,rack,radar,radio,rail,rain,raise,rally,ramp,ranch,random,range,rapid,rare,rate,rather,raven,raw,razor,ready,real,reason,rebel,rebuild,recall,receive,recipe,record,recycle,reduce,reflect,reform,refuse,region,regret,regular,reject,relax,release,relief,rely,remain,remember,remind,remove,render,renew,rent,reopen,repair,repeat,replace,report,require,rescue,resemble,resist,resource,response,result,retire,retreat,return,reunion,reveal,review,reward,rhythm,rib,ribbon,rice,rich,ride,ridge,rifle,right,rigid,ring,riot,ripple,risk,ritual,rival,river,road,roast,robot,robust,rocket,romance,roof,rookie,room,rose,rotate,rough,round,route,royal,rubber,rude,rug,rule,run,runway,rural,sad,saddle,sadness,safe,sail,salad,salmon,salon,salt,salute,same,sample,sand,satisfy,satoshi,sauce,sausage,save,say,scale,scan,scare,scatter,scene,scheme,school,science,scissors,scorpion,scout,scrap,screen,script,scrub,sea,search,season,seat,second,secret,section,security,seed,seek,segment,select,sell,seminar,senior,sense,sentence,series,service,session,settle,setup,seven,shadow,shaft,shallow,share,shed,shell,sheriff,shield,shift,shine,ship,shiver,shock,shoe,shoot,shop,short,shoulder,shove,shrimp,shrug,shuffle,shy,sibling,sick,side,siege,sight,sign,silent,silk,silly,silver,similar,simple,since,sing,siren,sister,situate,six,size,skate,sketch,ski,skill,skin,skirt,skull,slab,slam,sleep,slender,slice,slide,slight,slim,slogan,slot,slow,slush,small,smart,smile,smoke,smooth,snack,snake,snap,sniff,snow,soap,soccer,social,sock,soda,soft,solar,soldier,solid,solution,solve,someone,song,soon,sorry,sort,soul,sound,soup,source,south,space,spare,spatial,spawn,speak,special,speed,spell,spend,sphere,spice,spider,spike,spin,spirit,split,spoil,sponsor,spoon,sport,spot,spray,spread,spring,spy,square,squeeze,squirrel,stable,stadium,staff,stage,stairs,stamp,stand,start,state,stay,steak,steel,stem,step,stereo,stick,still,sting,stock,stomach,stone,stool,story,stove,strategy,street,strike,strong,struggle,student,stuff,stumble,style,subject,submit,subway,success,such,sudden,suffer,sugar,suggest,suit,summer,sun,sunny,sunset,super,supply,supreme,sure,surface,surge,surprise,surround,survey,suspect,sustain,swallow,swamp,swap,swarm,swear,sweet,swift,swim,swing,switch,sword,symbol,symptom,syrup,system,table,tackle,tag,tail,talent,talk,tank,tape,target,task,taste,tattoo,taxi,teach,team,tell,ten,tenant,tennis,tent,term,test,text,thank,that,theme,then,theory,there,they,thing,this,thought,three,thrive,throw,thumb,thunder,ticket,tide,tiger,tilt,timber,time,tiny,tip,tired,tissue,title,toast,tobacco,today,toddler,toe,together,toilet,token,tomato,tomorrow,tone,tongue,tonight,tool,tooth,top,topic,topple,torch,tornado,tortoise,toss,total,tourist,toward,tower,town,toy,track,trade,traffic,tragic,train,transfer,trap,trash,travel,tray,treat,tree,trend,trial,tribe,trick,trigger,trim,trip,trophy,trouble,truck,true,truly,trumpet,trust,truth,try,tube,tuition,tumble,tuna,tunnel,turkey,turn,turtle,twelve,twenty,twice,twin,twist,two,type,typical,ugly,umbrella,unable,unaware,uncle,uncover,under,undo,unfair,unfold,unhappy,uniform,unique,unit,universe,unknown,unlock,until,unusual,unveil,update,upgrade,uphold,upon,upper,upset,urban,urge,usage,use,used,useful,useless,usual,utility,vacant,vacuum,vague,valid,valley,valve,van,vanish,vapor,various,vast,vault,vehicle,velvet,vendor,venture,venue,verb,verify,version,very,vessel,veteran,viable,vibrant,vicious,victory,video,view,village,vintage,violin,virtual,virus,visa,visit,visual,vital,vivid,vocal,voice,void,volcano,volume,vote,voyage,wage,wagon,wait,walk,wall,walnut,want,warfare,warm,warrior,wash,wasp,waste,water,wave,way,wealth,weapon,wear,weasel,weather,web,wedding,weekend,weird,welcome,west,wet,whale,what,wheat,wheel,when,where,whip,whisper,wide,width,wife,wild,will,win,window,wine,wing,wink,winner,winter,wire,wisdom,wise,wish,witness,wolf,woman,wonder,wood,wool,word,work,world,worry,worth,wrap,wreck,wrestle,wrist,write,wrong,yard,year,yellow,you,young,youth,zebra,zero,zone,zoo
submitted by lowcarbjc to btc [link] [comments]

How to mine bitcoins (solo mining) with the core client ... Getting your Private Keys from the Bitcoin Core wallet ... Bitcoin Core Server for Windows 2016 Bitcoin Core Setup Bitcoin Core Wallet  Bitcoin core wallet  How to ...

It’s final at last folks, the next major update for Windows Phone, dubbed ‘Mango,’ will rename the phone line Windows Phone 7.5. While the coming name is ugly, and will merely confuse users ... Many serious bitcoin investors use a hybrid approach: They hold a core, long-term amount of bitcoin offline in so-called “cold storage,” while keeping a spending balance in a mobile account. A savoir, bitcoin core permet aussi la génération d’adresse à la volée. 5) Acheter des bitcoins sur paymium. Pour cela, créditez votre compte en euros en réalisant un virement bancaire. C’est très simple et vraiment bien expliqué ! Mango says: November 17, 2017 at 1:51 am If the computer which holds my offline Electrum wallet completely fries and gives up the ghost, can I restore my wallet and its Bitcoin through the process you’ve described above? Thanks a lot! Reply. Abdussamad says: November 17, 2017 at 3:21 am yes. Reply. Tom says: November 22, 2017 at 1:21 am Its held on a USB not an offline computer – so simply ... News: Latest Bitcoin Core release: 0.20.0 Home : Help: Search: Login: Register: More : Bitcoin Forum. Bitcoin. Bitcoin Discussion General discussion about the Bitcoin ecosystem that doesn't fit better elsewhere. News, the Bitcoin community, innovations, the general environment, etc. Discussion of specific Bitcoin-related services usually belongs in other sections. Moderator: hilariousandco ...

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How to mine bitcoins (solo mining) with the core client ...

Produced by https://CryptoCousins.com: On this episode we install a Bitcoin Core Full Node. Watch as we figure out the process. Join Tony Cecala and Gary Lel... Bitcoin Core is a quick deployment official Bitcoin cryptocurrency client. Bitcoin Core Server for Windows 2016 Bitcoin Core is an open-source software that serves as a bitcoin node (the set of ... To Purchase Bitcoin, Ethereum or litecoin: https://www.coinbase.com/join/51f5ead5d8be1677d5000003 Getting your Private Keys from the Bitcoin Core wallet - Duration: 5:11. Bitcoin Daytrader 45,398 views. 5:11 . Install, Backup And Restore A Bitcoin Wallet. Or, Almost Any CryptoCoin Wallet ... In this tutorial we are going to get our private keys from the bitcoin core wallet. This only works when you created the bitcoin address in the same wallet. ...

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